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Old 04-14-2007, 04:02 PM
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Default IRCM/CCRM details

So the ccrm that came on the car when I bought it broke, it had a letter M on it and I have now found out that is the right one for my 93 mtx. I bought a module with a J on it from a junk yard and it works but my car isnt recognizing the new cps it seems like. I just wanted to know what will go wrong if I do not have the right ccrm.

-craig
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Old 04-14-2007, 04:06 PM
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from what i always knew was the J was for autos but then i read some mtx's had it, I also read that they all work on any car. Id try to get one with an M on it and see if that helps. My mechanic said i couldnt use the one with the J and made me go get one with an M so who knows.
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Old 04-14-2007, 04:13 PM
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I had a J in my car when i got it. Well i had some problems and i replaced i with an M. It was not the problem, but i have had no ill effects of switching the two.
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Old 04-14-2007, 04:21 PM
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thanks I appreciate it. I have just had so many problems with this car I am trying to rule out everything.
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Old 04-14-2007, 04:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hypnotic
thanks I appreciate it. I have just had so many problems with this car I am trying to rule out everything.
well id say replacing it with one thats got the same letter of yours is your best bet then, that way you knows for a fact its the same
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Old 04-14-2007, 04:39 PM
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Trust me, get an M.
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Old 04-14-2007, 09:56 PM
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Why? Is there some benefit to having the "M" over the "J" (like the D4U1), or because it can/does create porblems having the wrong module?
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Old 04-15-2007, 12:52 AM
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Just a few things to think about.

When I was a newbie, I tried an M in our 95MTX (it needs a D). The fuel pump would not work with the M, so it couldn't even start. In our case, the incompatibility saved us some hardship. I know one possible incorrect CCRM combination will let the car start, but it will not allow the cooling fan to come on. In this case, you have an engine waiting to overheat if you do not see the temp gauge spike up.

Now think about the other differences

ATX has two fans, MTX has one.

94/95 has two speed fan, 89-93 have single speed fan.

I keep hearing people say it does not matter, but I have seen evidence to the contrary. Why take a chance when you could just put the right part in?

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Old 04-15-2007, 01:58 AM
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I think you misinterpreted my post - I am asking because I want to truly want to know. So much of what is passed around here, is often based solely on "WOMs" (word-of-mouth), often based on something someone heard from someone else. I want to know because I have always installed the correct OEM part when I can, not just the one someone says will work ("..., trust me, it will work just fine...."). Been there, listen to that, and learned that leason the hard way long ago....

Quote:
Originally Posted by shopartsnw
Mike (tired from a day of wrenching - sorry for the vent)
I heard that! I spent from 1145-1600 on the lift, under the car today....

Btw, still have those rear 90-92 rotors?
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Old 04-15-2007, 02:23 AM
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Storm Chaser,

My apologies, I should have explained better. I just don't like arguing on forums anymore. I won't argue, but I should explain.

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Old 04-15-2007, 04:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shopartsnw
I know one possible incorrect CCRM combination will let the car start, but it will not allow the cooling fan to come on.
What combination is that?
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Old 04-15-2007, 12:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TYSHO
What combination is that?
Somehow, I knew that question would come up. At some point, I may need to do a detailed study of CCRM swaps, but I can't even think about it until Karen's race car is built (about 3 weeks).

I can remember this from memory:

M will not operate the fuel pump if it needed a D (94/95 MTX)

D seems to operate in place of an M, but I would need more detailed study to verify the cooling fan, etc.

As for the J into an M car, we have sold a couple M's to people on the forum who had Js and thier cooling fans were not coming on. I would need to reproduce the effects, but it could be a J in an M car won't operate fans, or it could be that a J in an M car will fail at some point due to some wiring difference. It could also just be a coincidence as we have also sold M's to people with bad M's. J into M is my best bet for a cooling fan issue.

I have not tried an M into a J car, but I am sure someone here has.

Sorry I couldn't be more specific.

Mike
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Old 04-15-2007, 02:49 PM
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Well, I guess I can do the testing with the "J" and "M" ones since I have both in working condition, that way we know for sure.

Perhaps some failures to operate might have been from damaged modules?

For a fact, I know the "D" code works on "J" code ATX's. However, the "J" code is also used in the regular Taurus as well during the 90's, which I have not tested with a "D" code. There's some other combos that work as well, but I would need to gather the information or have that person post them.
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Old 04-16-2007, 05:21 PM
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Well, I don't have an M code schematic, but I do have the J and D codes.

J code:




D code:




Judge for yourself.
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Old 04-16-2007, 06:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeye18
Well, I don't have an M code schematic, but I do have the J and D codes.

J code:




D code:




Judge for yourself.
Thanks! Now we need a "M" pin out and we will be set.
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Old 04-16-2007, 10:02 PM
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Well, as long as a 93 MTX uses an "M" code CCRM, here you go.



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Old 04-16-2007, 11:59 PM
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A sticky is in order! Thanks again!
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Old 04-17-2007, 11:57 AM
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The CCRM controls power to the fuel pump, AC and cooling fans. I tried to explain a bit of the details on my web page. For sure, as you have noted all three boxes are not fully interchangeable.

Bob's CCRM page

I own a 95 mtx (D), a 93 atx (J) and a 92 (M). In my mountain of spare parts I also have all three boxes. Maybe I should try all the combinations and report back with the results.


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Old 04-17-2007, 01:05 PM
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Default IRCM/CCRM info

(Note: I wrote this up this morning. Needs proofed. If you find a mistake or see anything questionable, please PM your comments to me, do not make an additional post. I will edit any needed changes. Thanks.)

IRCM/CCRM Functions/Pin-outs

The IRCM/CCRM performs four functions on the SHO:

1) EEC Power Switching

2) Fuel Pump Relay Switching

3) Cooling Fan Power Control

4) A/C Clutch Control


All years, all versions:

Pin 15 is ground.
Pin 16 (A/C Coil low side) is connected to pin 15 internally.
Pin 8 is ALWAYS HOT.
Pin 13 is HOT in RUN/START.

1. EEC Power Switching: When the ignition switch is turned to START/RUN, switched power is applied to the high side of the EEC POWER RELAY coil (low side is grounded). The COMMON terminal of the AC POWER RELAY is connected to pin 8. The output of the EEC POWER RELAY is supplied to the high side of the fuel pump, fan, and AC clutch coils and is distributed out pin 24 as SWITCHED B+ to the PCM and to various sensors and actuators on the engine when this relay is energized.

2. A/C Clutch Control: There are two inputs to the A/C clutch circuit and one output:

A) A/C Request signal (Pin 21). This is a switched HIGH (battery voltage) signal that is true when the EATC/HVAC control and the cycling switch have requested compressor clutch operation.

B) WAC* (WOT A/C Cutout - Pin 22). This is an active LOW (ground) signal from the PCM that is enabled when the PCM has determined that compressor operation must be disabled, i.e., under heavy acceleration.

C) A/C Clutch Coil (Pin 23). This is an active HIGH (battery voltage) signal that is true only when Pin 21 is high and pin 22 is not LOW.


Variations by Type

Fuel Pump Control

All versions provide output on Pin 5.
Type M:
(89-93 MTX) IRCM boxes contain two fuel pump relays. 89 and 90 used an external dropping resistor in the supply line for the LOW SPEED FP RELAY common (Pin 10). 91 and 92 MY vehicles have a jumper that applies full B+ to the supply of the LOW SPEED FP RELAY. All years supply B+ to the HIGH SPEED FP RELAY common via pin 12. The NO contacts of both relays are tied together internally in the box and is output on pin 5. The LOW SPEED FP RELAY is energized by the PCM by applying a ground to Pin 18 (Note: The FP TEST pin on the DLC is connected to this pin). The HIGH SPEED FP RELAY is energized by the PCM by applying a ground to pin 11.

Types D and J:
(93-95 ATX, 94-95 MTX) CCRM has a single FP RELAY. B+ power is supplied to the common terminal via pin 12. The FP RELAY is energized by the PCM (or grounding the FP TEST pin on the DLC) by grounding pin 18.


Cooling Fan

Type M:
(89-93 MTX) Single speed. Input fan power is supplied to pins 1 & 2. A single fan relay is energized by applying an active ground to pin 14. Output switched power is output on pins 3 & 4 to the electric fan.

Type D:
(94-95 MTX) Dual speed cooling fan (dual coil). Input fan power is supplied to pins 3 & 4. LOW SPEED FAN RELAY is energized by a ground on pin 14 and switches power to pins 1 & 2 which is routed to the low speed fan winding. HIGH SPEED FAN RELAY is energized by a ground on pin 17 and switches power to pins 6 & 7 which is routed to the high speed fan winding. Due to an internal switching diode, application of a low on pin 17 will result in BOTH fan relays being energized.

Type J:
(93-95 ATX) Dual fans in parallel with an external low speed dropping resistor. Input power via resistor is applied to pins 1 & 2 to the common terminal of the LOW SPEED FAN RELAY. The relay is energized by applying a ground to pin 14. Switched power is output on pins 3 & 4. Full battery power is input via pins 6 & 7 to the HIGH SPEED FAN RELAY common terminal. The relay is energized by grounding pin 17. Switched power is output on pins 3 & 4.
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Old 05-01-2007, 07:25 PM
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How about this...

I should have an M and I have a J but my fan still kicks on. I thought it wasn't supposed to?

-craig
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Old 05-01-2007, 07:34 PM
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How'd it get a J? Computer swap?

Try to get the oasis report on your car.
It might be that it had a problem for the first owner that was solved at the dealer under warranty. That repair may have entailed a computer/other parts swap.
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Old 05-01-2007, 08:12 PM
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hypnotic, Your CCRM is only partially working. Actually you only have the low fan speed working. To get the high fan speed you need to use an "M". Since you are in a southern (warmer) state, I would recommend that you get the correct CCRM. M boxes are very common, so you should have no trouble getting one.
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Old 05-04-2007, 05:16 PM
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I plan on it, I heard it kick on the other day and wanted to let everyone know, but I guess it doesn't work properly.. just kinda.

-craig
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Old 05-05-2007, 09:32 AM
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Guys, post troubleshooting situations in the regular forum, not in "stickied" posts.

This thread should be used primairly for reference.

Steve
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Old 11-19-2007, 08:59 PM
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I have a 93 ATX. Which pin # is the wire that the computer chip sends the signal to ground out in order to open the butterflies at ~4,000 RPM? I want to install a toggle switch so that I can ground out the wire manually and have the butterflies open all the time when I want it versus having to unplug the vacuum line. That way I can switch between getting good gas mileage vs race time.

My guess is narrowed down to 22 (WOT) but might be also 14 as well. Anyone know?
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Old 11-19-2007, 10:57 PM
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Here is the PCM pinout for a 93 ATX:



As you can see, you want pin 34. It's light green and pink. Hope this helps!

OBTW, this is off the computer, not the ICRM...
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Old 11-20-2007, 08:10 AM
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Since you can't follow instructions, I have locked this thread.

Start a new thread in the proper place.

Steve
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Old 07-20-2008, 05:10 PM
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Default Schematics added

Attached.

Click to open pdf file.

Steve
Attached Files
File Type: pdf IRCM Code M 89-93 MTX Schematic.pdf (31.3 KB, 24 views)

Last edited by projectSHO89; 07-20-2008 at 05:12 PM.
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